Srimad Bhagavatam 11.12.17 | HH Bhanu Swami Maharaj | ISKCON Chennai | 17 June 2021
jaya rādhā-mādhava kuñja-vihārī
gopījana-vallabha giri-vara-dhārī
yaśodā-nandana vraja-jana-rañjana
yamunā-tīra-vana-cārī
Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare
Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare
Jaya Prabhupāda Jaya Prabhupāda
Prabhupāda Jaya Prabhupāda
Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya
Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya
Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya
nama oṁ viṣṇu-pādāya kṛṣṇa-preṣṭhāya bhū-tale
śrīmate bhaktivedānta-svāmin iti nāmine
namas te sārasvate deve gaura-vāṇī-pracāriṇe
nirviśeṣa-śūnyavādi-pāścātya-deśa-tāriṇe
jaya śrī-kṛṣṇa-caitanya prabhu-nityānanda
śrī-advaita gadādhara śrīvāsādi-gaura-bhakta-vṛnda
Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare
Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare
Reading from Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 11 Chapter 12 Verse 17.
ŚB 11.12.17
श्रीभगवानुवाच
स एष जीवो विवरप्रसूति:
प्राणेन घोषेण गुहां प्रविष्ट: ।
मनोमयं सूक्ष्ममुपेत्य रूपं
मात्रा स्वरो वर्ण इति स्थविष्ठ: ॥ १७ ॥
śrī-bhagavān uvāca
sa eṣa jīvo vivara-prasūtiḥ
prāṇena ghoṣeṇa guhāṁ praviṣṭaḥ
mano-mayaṁ sūkṣmam upetya rūpaṁ
mātrā svaro varṇa iti sthaviṣṭhaḥ
Synonyms
śrī-bhagavān uvāca — the Supreme Personality of Godhead said; saḥ eṣaḥ — He Himself; jīvaḥ — the Supreme Lord, who gives life to all; vivara — within the heart; prasūtiḥ — manifest; prāṇena — along with the life air; ghoṣeṇa — with the subtle manifestation of sound; guhām — the heart; praviṣṭaḥ — who has entered; manaḥ-mayam — perceived by the mind, or controlling the mind even of great demigods like Lord Śiva; sūkṣmam — subtle; upetya — being situated in; rūpam — the form; mātrā — the different vocalic lengths; svaraḥ — the different intonations; varṇaḥ — the different sounds of the alphabet; iti — thus; sthaviṣṭhaḥ — the gross form.
Translation
The Supreme Personality of Godhead said: My dear Uddhava, the Supreme Lord gives life to every living being and is situated within the heart along with the life air and primal sound vibration. The Lord can be perceived in His subtle form within the heart by one’s mind, since the Lord controls the minds of everyone, even great demigods like Lord Śiva. The Supreme Lord also assumes a gross form as the various sounds of the Vedas, composed of short and long vowels and consonants of different intonations.
Purport
Śrīla Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura comments as follows on the dialogue between Lord Kṛṣṇa and Uddhava. Uddhava was bewildered and doubtful because Lord Kṛṣṇa explained many different processes such as devotional service, speculative knowledge, renunciation, mystic yoga, austerities, pious duties, and so on. However, all of these processes are meant to help the living entities obtain the shelter of Lord Kṛṣṇa, and ultimately no Vedic process should be understood in any other way. Thus Lord Kṛṣṇa explained the entire Vedic system, placing everything in proper order. In fact, Lord Kṛṣṇa was surprised that Uddhava foolishly thought that he was meant to practice every process, as if each method were meant simply for him. Lord Kṛṣṇa therefore wants to inform His devotee, “My dear Uddhava, when I told you that analytic knowledge is to be practiced, pious duties are to be performed, devotional service is obligatory, yoga procedures must be observed, austerities are to be executed, etc., I was instructing all living entities, using you as My immediate audience. That which I have spoken, am speaking now and will speak in the future should be understood as guidance for all living entities in different situations. How could you possibly think that you were meant to practice all of the different Vedic processes? I accept you as you are now, My pure devotee. You are not supposed to execute all of these processes.” Thus according to Śrīla Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura, the Lord, with lighthearted and encouraging words, reveals to Uddhava the deep purpose behind the variety of Vedic procedures.
Lord Kṛṣṇa became manifest from the mouth of Lord Brahmā in the form of the Vedas. The word vivara-prasūti in this verse also indicates that the Lord is manifest within the ādhārādi-cakras situated within the body of Lord Brahmā. The word ghoṣeṇa means “subtle sound,” and guhāṁ praviṣṭaḥ also indicates that Lord Kṛṣṇa enters within the ādhāra-cakra. The Lord can further be perceived within other cakras such as the maṇipūraka-cakra, located around the navel, and the viśuddhi-cakra. The Sanskrit alphabet is composed of short and long vowels, and consonants pronounced with high and low tones, and utilizing these vibrations the different branches of Vedic literatures are manifested as a gross form of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. According to Bhagavad-gītā, such literatures deal mostly with the three modes of material nature: traiguṇya-viṣayā vedā nistrai-guṇyo bhavārjuna. Śrīla Śrīdhara Svāmī explains that due to the control of the illusory energy, māyā, the Personality of Godhead appears to the conditioned souls as part of the material universe. The imagined imposition of gross and subtle material qualities on the Personality of Godhead is called avidyā, or ignorance, and through such ignorance the living entity considers himself to be the doer of his own activities and becomes bound up in the network of karma. The Vedas therefore order an entangled soul to observe positive and negative injunctions to purify his existence. These procedures are called pravṛtti-mārga, or the path of regulated fruitive activities. When one has purified one’s existence, one gives up this gross stage of fruitive activities because it is detrimental to the practice of pure devotional service. By firm faith one may then worship the Personality of Godhead. One who has developed perfect Kṛṣṇa consciousness no longer has to perform ritualistic duties. As stated in Bhagavad-gītā, tasya kāryaṁ na vidyate.
According to Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī, this verse may be understood in another way. The word jīva indicates Lord Kṛṣṇa, who gives life to the residents of Vṛndāvana, and vivara-prasūti indicates that although Lord Kṛṣṇa eternally performs His pastimes in the spiritual world, beyond the vision of the conditioned souls, He also enters within the material universe to display these same pastimes. The words guhāṁ praviṣṭaḥ indicates that after displaying such pastimes, the Lord withdraws them and enters into His unmanifest pastimes, or those pastimes not manifest to the conditioned souls. In this case, mātrā indicates the transcendental senses of the Lord, svara indicates the Lord’s transcendental sound vibration and singing, and the word varṇa indicates the transcendental form of the Lord. The word sthaviṣṭha, or “gross manifestation,” means that the Lord becomes manifest in the material world even to those devotees who are not completely advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and whose vision is not completely purified. Mano-maya indicates that somehow or other Lord Kṛṣṇa is to be kept within one’s mind; and for the nondevotees Lord Kṛṣṇa is sūkṣma, or most subtle, because He cannot be known. Thus different ācāryas have glorified Lord Kṛṣṇa in different ways through the transcendental sound vibration of this verse.
HH Bhanu Swami Maharaj:
So, Uddhava was confused by the various processes that the Lord had explained. And here, Krishna begins to respond to that. However, we’ll find that the answer is a little complicated. It can be interpreted in different ways. In any case, he’s talking here about the jiva. And how the jiva is able to realize the Lord.
So, as explained in the purport, ultimately, there are different types of jivas, and for different types of jivas, the Lord gives different processes. In other words, the Lord manifests himself differently to different people according to different processes. For Vishwanath Chakravarti Thakur, this verse explains how the Vedas, which are a form of the Lord, manifest in the world. So, the Vedas are a form of the Lord. But they are spiritual. Nevertheless, when we hear the Vedas, it looks like material sound. So, how does the Lord, who is beyond the material senses and beyond sound, become manifest as something which is heard by our material ear?
So, this verse explains how the Vedas manifest. So there are different stages actually four stages of the evolution of the spiritual sound in this world .And these are also associated with different chakras of the body. So, the first state is the absolute spiritual state, called Para. And this enters the Muladhara Chakra, or base chakra, the one at the bottom of the spine, but in Lord Brahma. Then, this sound rises up to the navel chakra, called Manipuraka. And then it goes to the heart chakra, called Anahata Chakra. And then finally, it goes to the Visuddha Chakra, at the throat. And there, those sounds manifest as the syllables of the Veda that we speak and hear.
So, in other words, the pure sound takes on different characteristics until we can hear it within this world. But the spiritual nature does not change. So, though we can hear the Vedas in this world, that doesn’t mean they are material, because we hear them with our material ear, they are still spiritual. Nevertheless, they take on a form which we can say with the voice and we can hear with the ear. In this way, the Lord becomes manifest in the Vedas through sound. And if we compare the different processes, again the Lord manifests in different ways in different processes. So, through Karma Yoga, the Lord manifests through material objects of enjoyment. Through the process of Jnana, the Lord manifests as impersonal Brahman. Through the process of Yoga, the Lord manifests as Siddhi. And through the process of Bhakti, the Lord manifests as one form.
So, the Lord is one, but He manifests differently to different types of people. So, according to qualification, then we will get different practices and different realizations of the Lord. But they are not equal realizations. We know that Brahman, Paramatma and Bhagavan are one entity, Advaita Jnana. Yet, the realization of Brahman is not as complete as the realization of Paramatma. And the realization of Paramatma is not as complete as the realization of Bhagavan.
So, the Lord is one in all of these different realizations. At the same time, there is difference. So, according to qualification therefore we get different grades of realization of the Lord. And the process that gives the most complete realization is the best process. And it is the goal of the other process. So, therefore, though Krishna spoke all of these different processes to Uddhava, ultimately he is recommending the process of Bhakti. So, in the practice of Bhakti also, there we get different stages. And in these different stages, we will get a different type of realization of the Lord. So, up to the stage of Bhava, we do Sadhana Bhakti. But we don’t have a direct realization of the Lord. In Bhava stage, there is a direct realization of the Lord. But even that realization is not complete. So, in Prema, we have a complete realization of the Lord. So, this is actually the goal of Bhakti, not to stay in Sadhana, but to progress to Bhava and then to Prema. This gives us the most complete realization of the Lord.
However, ordinary people in this world are not qualified for Prem Bhakti, so they will never see the Lord. Therefore, they have to start with Sadhana Bhakti. We also act according to our qualification. So, if we are qualified for Bhakti, then we start with Sadhana Bhakti. And by doing this, we will be qualified with Bhava Bhakti. And through Bhava Bhakti, then we get to Prema. So, therefore, we have to act according to the qualification. Similarly, some people are qualified for Karma Yoga, some for Jnana Yoga, some for Ashtanga Yoga and some for Bhakti Yoga. But, there is also some difference. In Bhakti, it is all Bhakti. It is Bhakti in Sadhana, Bhakti in Bhava, Bhakti in Prema.
So, we have the same practices, the same activities, the same goal. When we go to Karma Yoga, Jnana Yoga, Astanga Yoga and Bhakti Yoga, the processes are different, the goals are different. So, when we go to Jnana Yoga from Karma Yoga, we give up the Karma Yoga activities, we practice separately. We give up the goals of Karma Yoga, Swarga Loka etc. and we strive for liberation. When we go to Bhakti, we give up the Jnana and we strive for Prema. So, there is also differences between the whole practice of Bhakti in it’s stages and the practices in other processes. The ultimate difference is that the other practices are all material. And therefore, we change one process to the other. The process of Bhakti is spiritual. So, it is eternal. We don’t change it. So, there is a big difference between these processes. So, once we attain the stage of Bhakti, we don’t have to change the process anymore. By practicing gradually, we get deeper and deeper realization of the Lord.
Okay Hare Krishna.
Q & A:
1.) In this verse the importance is given for Bhakti and asking Uddhava to ignore other processes. But most of the souls in material world are not pure devotees and are Sadhana Bhaktas. How to understand this Maharaj?
So it is according to qualification. If you are qualified for Bhakti like Uddhava or Arjuna, then you do Bhakti. If you are not qualified for Bhakti, then you may do Karma Yoga or Jnana Yoga. So therefore the processes depend upon the person. However, at the end of Bhagavad Gita, Krishna gives a general direction for everybody. Give up everything and just do bhakti. He says the same to Uddhava. How we can take that instruction? Oh it is because Uddhava and Arjuna are Nitya Siddha devotees anyway. So [Laughs] no problem for them. He is also preaching and giving the instruction to everybody in the material world. In other words, it is difficult to do these other practices in Kali Yuga. So better you just do Bhakti. But if you don’t have faith, we cannot do Bhakti. Therefore, somehow we have to keep the faith.
We cannot say to all the faithless people, do Bhakti, do Bhakti. Sarva dharman parityajya [Bg 18.66]. But in the Bhagavad Gita at the end Krishna also says, do not preach this to the envious people and faithless people. You can only say this to people with faith. So the first duty of the devotee is to make all the people of the world develop faith. And then he can give this instruction to do bhakti.
Devotee : Jai.
2.) Maharaj, this question is It is referring to Bhagavad Gita sloka 12.5. Where in it says impersonalists who later become devotees experience serious problems both at neophyte stage and later at more advanced stages. So I am experiencing these problems and realize this when I see some blissful devotees. Please do guide me to overcome this?
So I suppose what he is saying there is that he may be influenced more by Jnana. So yes Jnana misra bhakti It is also doing bhakti so it is better than pure Jnana. However it is always better to practice pure bhakti. So it’s good to come from jnana to jnana-misra bhakti, but better to come to pure bhakti. So how to progress there? As with coming from jnana to jnana-misra bhakti, the same process to get to pure bhakti, that is association with devotees practicing, pure bhakti. So by that association, then that mixture of Jnana will gradually disappear. One we see [Laughs] is in the case of the Atmarama verse, Sukadeva Goswami, how he became such a great devotee. That was because he heard Bhagavatam. So by hearing the sweet pastimes of Krishna, then the attraction to Jnana will disappear.
Devotee : Jai.
3.) Maharaj, is How does the Mahamantra differ from the Vedas as spiritual sound vibration? Does it also manifest and work just like the Vedic sound vibration?
So it is all spiritual. So it is all non-different from the Lord. Still we will see there are differences between Krishna and Rama and Vishnu and Narasimha Dev. And there is differences between Brahman, Paramatma and Bhagavan. So of course the Vedas have all aspects, all Avatars all Brahman, Paramatma and Bhagavan. But the highest form Krishna is not directly manifested. Of course Krishna is mentioned in the Vedas and in Gopala Tapani Upanishad but it is not so frequent. And we can say that the Gayathri Mantra is of Vishnu which is equal to Krishna so in that sense it is all spiritual. So the Gayathri mantra is non different from the lord, Om is non different from the lord, that’s true [Laughs]. Yet we find that even the names of Krishna and the mantras of Krishna are also non different from Krishna. Yet, Nama Sankirtan is considered to be even better than all of these.
I think in Caitanya Caritamrita it’s there by mantra you get liberation but by Nama you get Prema. So what the name does, of course we can say that Krishna Mantra will also give you Prema but the name of Krishna will get you Goloka. So the name is very very powerful. It is very direct. Therefore, it is the quickest way to get the highest goal. Though Available through the Vedas, Vaishnava Mantras etc. but it is a slower process. So the name gets us to the highest realization in the quickest time.
4.) Maharaj, How does the transcendental sound gets transferred when we listen to it online or through a recording?
So if it is recorded etc. It is somewhat artificial. Therefore the original speakers they didn’t use mechanical devices the Guru spoke to the student. He didn’t even use writing. It was all through sound itself from Guru to disciple. So that is the best way to preserve the Para sound. Nevertheless, now we have other means. So we have printed books, we have recordings and videos and so many things. So we cannot say they are useless. But it is more difficult to access that Para sound or spiritual sound through them. So therefore it’s always preferable we also have personal association, therefore Sadhu Sanga is always emphasized. If we don’t have any opportunities, it is fine we can use tape recordings and whatever. But if we have direct association, it is always preferable.
Devotee : Jai, Jai. Thank you Maharaj.
5.) What qualification is required for a devotee in Sadhana Bhakti to attain Bhava Bhakti? And what qualification is required for a Bhava Bhakta to attain Prema?
So the basic qualification for all is pure Bhakti. So that is defined by Rupa Goswami in the beginning of Nectar of Devotion. And there he says anya abhilasita sunyam jnana karmadi anavrtam. So if we practice Sadhana Bhakti properly with this concept, then we get to Anartha nivritti, Nistha, Ruchi, Asakti and we get to Bhava. Bhava to Prema is not in Sadhana in the normal sense. We are not practicing [Laughs]. Bhava is said to be the bud of Prema. So Bhava naturally blossoms into Prema.
6.) This is with reference to the last verse of Srimad Bhagavad Gita. yatra yogeshwara krishna verse. In this verse, does it mean Bhakti Yoga gives the benefit of performing all other process of Yoga and much more?
Whatever Karma Yoga can give or Jnana Yoga or Astanga Yoga can give, Bhakti gives that all. The same with chanting Hare Krishna. So therefore the name is called Cintamani. So as the Cintamani stone gives anything you desire, the holy name can give anything in the material world, [Not clear] liberation, anything in Prema.
7.) If a person chants all his lifetime and still does not get Krishna Prema, is it because he did not chant Suddha Nama?
Yeah but most likely, but Suddha Nama also depends upon knowledge and devotees association. And no aparadhas. So if it is not pure Bhakti and there are aparadhas then yes it becomes slower.
Devotees: Grantharaj Srimad Bhagavatam ki jai!!! HH Bhanu Swami Maharaj ki jai!!! His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada ki jai!!! Nitai Gaura premanande Hari Haribol!!!